Crucified???

[Slade]

Hydebound,

If we count the Moors Murderers as one, that would be the modern trinity. From where I'm typing, I can see BEYOND BELIEF (Pan edition purchased when books cost 95 cents), THE YORKSHIRE RIPPER by Roger Cross, THE YORKSHIRE RIPPER by Michael Nicholson, and "...SOMEBODY'S HUSBAND, SOMEBODY'S SON by Gordon Burn (all on Sutcliffe), and KILLING FOR COMPANY by Brian Masters, on Dennis Nilsen.

Slade

[Hydebound]

Do any of those YR books examine the theory that Sutcliffe was a copycat and that the actual Ripper is still at large? I had never heard this theory until recently.

[steelclaw32]

Just what is it with us Brits that we produce such an atrocious bunch of
people. It must be our weather or somethin'.

It's a rather horrible claim to fame is it not.?

As in...

Baby murder trial jury still out
A jury has retired to consider its verdicts for a fifth day in the case of a man accused of killing his lover's baby.
The Old Bailey jury heard that the 17-month-old toddler died from a broken back and other injuries in August last year at his home in Haringey, north London.

The 32-year-old unemployed handyman denies murder, and causing or allowing the death of the abused boy who was on the council's child protection register.
A second suspect, Jason Owen, 36, of Bromley, south east London, denies causing or allowing the death. He had been staying with the family for five weeks.

The boy's 27-year-old mother is on remand after pleading guilty to the same charge.

The family cannot be identified for legal reasons.

[dreab trawets]

Could be something in the water in Haringey
Remember this one....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2062590.stm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... abuse.html
Now we have all read in slades books, and in the media, and slade has probably seen countless cases of child abuse by people, but i feel, that a line must be drawn in the sand somewhere.

Yes, you may have been abused when young, but to do this to another human being, and a child at that means, in my view, that you should lose your baby rights. Chemical castration...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/2626581/Paedophiles-to-be-offered-form-of-chemical-castration.html

To be put into pits so we can through things and vilify them, and throw things at them, and to use them as guinea pigs for the cosmetic industry.

If they don't believe in human rights of their victim, then they should lose theirs.......

but.....

This is just me, and typically over the next couple of days, we shall see a long list come out, and much banging of the drum....

"The Separate Prison (or sometimes known as The Model Prison) was completed in 1853 and extended in 1855. The 80 cell prison was built in the shape of a cross with radial exercise yards around a central hall and chapel. It signalled a shift from physical punishment to psychological punishment. It was thought that the hard corporal punishment, such as whippings, used in other penal stations only served to harden criminals, and did nothing to turn them from their immoral ways. Under this system of punishment the "Silent System" was implemented in the building. Here prisoners were hooded and made to stay silent, this was supposed to allow time for the prisoner to reflect upon the actions which had brought him there."
PORT ARTHUR TASMANIA
They also buried them in LIME PITS.
Which keep on coming up now and again....
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/415 ... -of-Horror

anyway enough of my rantings....


Any islands lurking about the world.

[steelclaw32]

Victoria Climbie the poor lass, and that unfortunate baby murder
happened in the same area too. In fact it almost mirror's Climbie's verbatim here and there; Radio 5live's been full of it all day practically.

Yes, you may have been abused when young, but to do this to another human being, and a child at that means, in my view, that you should lose your baby rights. Chemical castration...

Well I wasn't, I agree with the sentiments which I've reddened.

Shakespeare said it all

The evil that men do lives after them;
The good is oft interred with their bones;

Julius Caesar. Act 3, scene 2,

Never were truer words ever uttered...As with anything he wrote.


Paedophiles just should be thrown into a very large rocket and sent in to space far far away, and pray, it gets hit by the most humongous meter/asteroid or summit similar. I really don't think honestly, chemical castration would work, even if you took off their 'flute' it's in their head not their thingie, I mean you can make a bloke a eunuch, but he still has the feelings....Is lobotomy to harsh.?

[Hydebound]

You Brits needn't feel uniquely cursed with monstrous countrymen; we here in the U.S. must lay claim, after all, to Herman Mudgett (AKA H. H. Holmes), Albert Fish, Charlies Starkweather and Manson, Eds Gein and Kemper, Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Wes Dodd(not the Golden Age Sandman),

[Hydebound]

Juan Corona, Dean Coryl, Charles Ng, Richard Speck, and a great many others.
Can any other country top THAT list?

[steelclaw32]

Hydebound wrote:

You Brits needn't feel uniquely cursed with monstrous countrymen; we here in the U.S. must lay claim, after all, to Herman Mudgett (AKA H. H. Holmes), Albert Fish, Charlies Starkweather and Manson, Eds Gein and Kemper, Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Wes Dodd(not the Golden Age Sandman), Juan Corona, Dean Coryl, Charles Ng, Richard Speck, and a great many others.
Can any other country top THAT list?

Quite probably Hyde, still doesn't make us Brits feel remotely unique,
ever since Jack The Ripper who now has more bloody sites on the net then just about any other serial killer. He's become a 'cult' figure.
The ultimate antihero now THAT is sick.

[Hydebound]

The sickness is evident here as well, my friend. Morbid weirdos collect Gacy's clown paintings, lonely freaks among the "fairer sex" send love letters to Richard "Night Stalker" Ramirez and did the same with Bundy. Manson is a superstar and I suppose people would still be laying wreaths at the grave of Saxon Hyde if he had actually existed. Wotta world.

[steelclaw32]

Too true Hyde, glad I'm not a father. It's a sad, vicious, mean, world.

[Hydebound]

Yes it is, but there are also love, beauty, genuine potential and moments of peace and discovery that make it more than worthwhile. We are a young civilization in the grand scheme of things; don't count us out just yet. On the other hand, there IS Sarah Palin...

[Vcela]

Juan Corona, Dean Coryl, Charles Ng, Richard Speck, and a great many others.
Can any other country top THAT list?

I'll submit that there are plenty of killers in all parts of the world. The advent of the serial killer is a relatively new phenomenon partly because the avenues of piracy and banditry are no longer available in a modern society. Sadists and sociopaths have always been around, they simply have fewer outlets in today's world.

Killing is only justifiable in the eyes of today's modern societies when some sort of defense is being enacted. By that I mean that the armed forces will proactively kill in order to defend the sanctity of the homeland. Police are only supposed to kill in situations where the public is in danger. Individuals can only justifiably kill in self-defence.

In Western culture, murderers are swiftly dealt with. They are isolated from the general public at large as quickly as possible. As a result (in my opinion), some individuals who feel the need/urge to kill have evolved by hiding their urges and deeds from society. When they are inevitably uncovered, especially in North America, media sensationalism is the result. The morbid fascination has led to cataloging and documentation. In a twisted way of looking at it we are actually making progress.

Which leads us to the following horrifying conclusion: Not only do serial killers exist in other parts of the world, they are much more prolific than almost anything we have seen in Europe and North American. Because of police corruption and general lack of organization in areas such as South America, Eastern Europe, Russia and India, by the time serial killers are caught they have already amassed body counts in the dozens, some in the hundreds.

[Hydebound]

You make some good points, Vcela. I believe that some genuine monsters are given outlets for their evil urges in settings like Abu Ghraib and Gitmo (Has any other country produced a thing as intellectually/morally/spiritually empty as George W.?). Various tyrants and tyrants-in-the-making have created outlets for violent impulses by putting automatic weapons into the hands of idle losers all around the world, unleashing horrors like Mao's Red Brigade, Pol Pot's crew and the assorted rebel factions infesting the African continent.

Slade already mentioned the abominable Chikatilo, and there was the "Monster of the Andes", who murdered a great many people (hundreds?). He was caught by a tribe who planned to execute the bastard in brutal fashion- until compelled to release him by a bleeding heart missionary, who bears much responsibility for the "Monster's" further crimes.

I'm writing this stuff from memory, so please excuse any spelling errors or omission of details.

[Slade]

Good discussion. I don't have the time to jump in, because I'm hard at work on another serial killer and the Website revamp (wait till you see it!), but incidents like the Devil's Wind required a certain type of mindset to perpetrate:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Rebellion_of_1857

The Indians called this retaliation "the Devil's Wind."

To the steady beat of drums, the captured rebels were first stripped of their uniforms and then tied to cannons, their bellies pushed hard against the gaping mouths of the big guns. The order to fire was given. With an enormous roar, all the cannons burst into life at once, generating a cloud of black smoke that snaked into the summer sky. When the smoke cleared, there was nothing left of the rebels' bodies except their arms, still tied to the cannons, and their blackened heads, which landed with a soft thud on the baking parade ground. It was a terrible way to die and a terrible sight to witness.

Slade

[steelclaw32]

Web revamp.!? OHHHHHH. I hope to God they remember to bring us along,! as it's a pain having to 'rejoin' again.!

Slade didn't you make mention of sorts, in passing, "the Devil's Wind" in Headhunter.? And should we be looking over our shoulders.!!!

Thanks for the heads up though.